Search Forum Home   Discussions  Ask the Ref Doctor  Scoring and div...  Scoring and diving    5/30/2006 10:25:48 PM Joe 25 posts Scoring and diving I'd just like to get a diagnosis of the following http://www.filecabi.net/video/kickme7.html . Please refresh me on the current rules on scoring and diving.  5/31/2006 9:59:49 AM Jeannette 176 posts Re: Scoring and diving While awaiting a response from the Doctor, I'd comment that, if the game was fought under WTF/USAT rules (which I assume it was, I recognize some of those faces), it looks like a clear three points,and apparently KO, for hong. The kyongo for falling AFTER the kick would be superfluous. The ref apparently thought so too, or he wouldn't have counted Chong. Jenny  5/31/2006 8:44:44 PM bckwh 104 posts Re: Scoring and diving Mr. Aguon, I cannot play the movie for which you provided the link, so I must respond based on Ms Woodard's accout of what happened. Not all of us use PCs; some of us use MACs. For that reason, it is probably better to describe situations as well as possible so that all of us have te same information. I say that, knowing that "a picture is worth a thousand words." Sounds to me that Hong scored with a face kick against Chung and proceeded to (for whatever reason) dive to the floor. Chung was counted out. You are questioning whether the Kyungo should have been awarded to Hong for intentionally falling. In normal circumstances, the answer would be YES. But, in this case, since there was a knockout, the Kyungo was (as stated by Ms Woodard) unnecessary because the match was over once the Referee reached the count of Yul (Ten). A corollary to that is whether the extra (third) point should be added to the score... Technically, the Referee should add the extra point before declaring the winner. It is at that point that the Referee would also declare the Kyungo against Hong, thus insuring that the final score is correct. ~BHarris  5/31/2006 9:20:54 PM Scott Zeiter 56 posts Re: Scoring and diving   Master Harris, First of all, I disagree that this was a dive at all. It appears, in my opinion, that this was a fall after a very nice spinning kick. Careless, maybe. Intentional, I don't think so. I would have given a warning for the fall, and that’s about it. However, since there was a knockout, even the warning would be a moot point. Second, being the technologist that I am. I have taken it upon myself to 'Yoink' (yes, that's a technical term for 'borrowing') the video, and convert it to a format that you in your technology challenged 'Mac' environment should be able to view. If you click on this link, you should be able to download and view the video in QuickTime format. For all other PC users, in case you haven't seen it yet, click here to download it in Windows Media format. Scott Zeiter I'm just here for the food...  6/1/2006 4:50:53 AM bckwh 104 posts Re: Scoring and diving Mr. Zeiter, than you for helping those of us who must make it in a PC world with our Macs. I was able to view the movie clip with QuickTime, and I agree with you. No Kyungo was necessary. The attack left Hong off balance, causing the fall. The KO would have ended the match and the Verbal Warning would have been a moot point. The fall did not seem to be intentional, rather, it was incidental to the spinning kick. ~BHarris  6/1/2006 1:19:45 PM Joe 25 posts Re: Scoring and diving Since I sent this out from my MAC I didn't think there would be a problem. I am using Safari for alot of things lately. How would the TA sheet read for either scenario?  6/1/2006 1:35:38 PM Joe 25 posts Re: Scoring and diving Dear Ref Doctor, Please induldge me on the following: New scenario, same end scene: Instructions to referee’s include: “try not to penalize every little slip” 14-17 Mens Black Belt Welterweight - WTF rules in effect Round 1 Hong attacks with whip kick misses and falls. Referee tells contestant to stay on his feet. Hong attacks again with whip kick misses and falls. Referee issues a Jui. Hong attacks again with whip kick misses and falls. Referee issues a Kyungo. Time runs out. End of round 1: Hong 0 Chung 0 Round 2 Hong attacks with whip kick misses and falls. Referee tells contestant to stay on his feet. Hong attacks again with whip kick misses and falls. Referee issues a Jui. Hong attacks again with whip kick misses and falls. Referee issues a Kyungo. Time runs out. End of round 2: Hong -1 Chung 0 Round 3 Hong attacks with whip kick misses and falls. Referee tells contestant to stay on his feet. Hong attacks again with whip kick and falls. Referee issues a Jui. Hong attacks again with whip kick misses and falls. Referee issues a Kyungo. Hong attacks again with whip kick hits the lottery by KO-ing chung and then hong falls. It seems to me that there are two possible outcomes: 1) Hong wins on KO 2) Chung wins on hong disqualification (Failure to obey the referee not staying up) How would the TA sheets read for each ending?  6/1/2006 8:48:10 PM bckwh 104 posts Re: Scoring and diving Mr. Aguon, thank you for your follow-up visit to the Doctor's Office. Here we go- First of all, there were too many verbal warnings given, in my opinion. Once the Referee determines that the competitor is not making an effort to stay on his/her feet, a Kyungo is preferred, rather than the verbal warnings. How many times does that take? That is the Referee's discretion. Personally, I would have given the Kyungos from the second time falling, especially considering that the kicks were not close to scoring. Were they close to scoring, I would have given additional verbal warnings as necessary. The final TA score sheet should have Hong winning by a knockout. Chung should not win by having Hong disqualified since the Referee only gave enough Kyungos to equal a total of minus one in deductions. Again, with Chung having been counted out as the result of a legal technique, there is no way that Chung should win in this match. Let me also add that it should be very rare that an athlete will be disqualified for not staying on their feet. The DQ should be for blatantly disobeying the Referee's instructions. For example, sitting in the ring and not getting up to resume the match after one minute. Other examples might include the following: throwing a chair in the ring (Coach or athlete), assaulting the Referee (Coach or athlete), etc. ~BHarris  Page 1 of 1   Discussions  Ask the Ref Doctor  Scoring and div... Flat View Tree View Oldest To Newest Newest To Oldest